Watercooler Talk

[DanPihlaja]

Hows it going @mattpeneguy ?

Just got an update from @mattpeneguy :
He texted and said, "Made out okay. No damage and have power." So he's a lucky one so far.

[AlexLachance]

Just got an update from @mattpeneguy :
He texted and said, "Made out okay. No damage and have power." So he's a lucky one so far.

Thanks for the update Dan!

[mike miller]

I don't get it.

??????

[AlexLachance]

I don't get it.

2021-08-31 10_17_50.jpg

??????

Ooookay

@Merovingien Care to enlighten us about what makes it a US-centered forum..? I'm not quite sure I understand.

P.S. I'm Canadian.

[Glenn Schroeder]

Ooookay

@Merovingien Care to enlighten us about what makes it a US-centered forum..? I'm not quite sure I understand.

P.S. I'm Canadian.

I believe @Frederick_Law is also, and it's obvious he's uncomfortable here.

[mike miller]

Ooookay

@Merovingien Care to enlighten us about what makes it a US-centered forum..? I'm not quite sure I understand.

P.S. I'm Canadian.

I think it works like racism. Denial of the allegation proves the allegation is correct.

[Frederick_Law]

You need to claim minority before you can cry racism .....

[SPerman]

I have no idea what he is talking about.

[SPerman]

Is this the survey that many of you have talked about participating in?

[DanPihlaja]

Have a great weekend y'all (Monday is Labor Day in the US, so many people have it off as a holiday). I am taking tomorrow off and traveling to the great Upper Peninsula of Michigan with my kids to visit my parents.

[Ömür Tokman]

Have a great weekend y'all (Monday is Labor Day in the US, so many people have it off as a holiday). I am taking tomorrow off and traveling to the great Upper Peninsula of Michigan with my kids to visit my parents.

Hey Dan Isn't Labor Day May 1st?

[matt]

Hey Dan Isn't Labor Day May 1st?

You might be thinking of Memorial Day, May 31. I always get those confused.

[Ömür Tokman]

You might be thinking of Memorial Day, May 31. I always get those confused.

May 1 Labor Day in Turkey and Europe. i thought it was in usa.

[Ömür Tokman]

Ok i get it.

[Glenn Schroeder]

May 1 Labor Day in Turkey and Europe. i thought it was in usa.

First Monday in September in the US.

[Ömür Tokman]

First Monday in September in the US.

Thanks for the info Glenn.

It seems that I will celebrate on May 1 in 2022.


Maybe one day I will celebrate it in September.

[zxys001]

Thanks for the info Glenn.

It seems that I will celebrate on May 1 in 2022.


Maybe one day I will celebrate it in September.

Labor day in the US is about the celebrating "the workers" or, "“workingmen’s holiday” ... it was created mainly because of the slave labor of pre/post 1900. That is, it reminds everyone their WORKERS RIGHTS and about the poor way companies treated their workers during that period of US history.


The official US Gov statement today is...
Observed the first Monday in September, Labor Day is an annual celebration of the social and economic achievements of American workers. The holiday is rooted in the late nineteenth century, when labor activists pushed for a federal holiday to recognize the many contributions workers have made to America’s strength, prosperity, and well-being.

[Ömür Tokman]

Labor day in the US is about the celebrating "the workers" or, "“workingmen’s holiday” ... it was created mainly because of the slave labor of pre/post 1900. That is, it reminds everyone their WORKERS RIGHTS and about the poor way companies treated their workers during that period of US history.


The official US Gov statement today is...
Observed the first Monday in September, Labor Day is an annual celebration of the social and economic achievements of American workers. The holiday is rooted in the late nineteenth century, when labor activists pushed for a federal holiday to recognize the many contributions workers have made to America’s strength, prosperity, and well-being.

actually this is an irony. What I mean by celebrating in the USA is to be able to go to the USA one day. I'm trying every legal means I can think of. A green card is pure luck. I've been looking for a sponsor for a h2b visa for about 3 years but still haven't found it. I still haven't given up.

[mike miller]

It would be cool if the majority of US workers would still be interested in working instead of sucking the teat....

[MJuric]

It would be cool if the majority of US workers would still be interested in working instead of sucking the teat....

I've often wondered how this worked. The US has a population of 331M. We have 73M under the age of 18 and 47 million over the age of 65. This leave ~211m people. The currently labor pool has ~160m people in it. We have 51M people between the age of 18 and 65 that aren't working? I'd actually say this number is even higher because we have a whole lot of people working that are over the age of 65. Not sure if under 18 is considered in the labor pool numbers though.

Nearly 25% of people of working age aren't working if we look at direct numbers and probably more if you consider late retiree's. Even if we pull out the stay at home parents ~13m we still have 38M people that aren't working. So one out of five people between the ages of 18 and 65 just don't work?

To make matters worse we have 160M people supporting 171M and those numbers are getting worse and worse as the boomers drop off one end and fewer and fewer people come in from the 0-18 age group.

It's not good.

[Tom G]

FYI, I advise that you prepare for this USA holiday weekend by ensuring that you will have the food, gasoline, and any other necessary resource (cash, water, butt wipes, pharma, w/e) needed for the following week. At best, you've got necessities even if there isn't a major disruption. Don't go hoarding.

https://us-cert.cisa.gov/ncas/alerts/aa21-243a
CISA has no actionable threat intelligence to predict criminal action, but it is instead based upon the three major ransomware attacks on critical infrastructure over the past Mother's Day, Memorial Day, and Independence Day this year. IT staff is not working on the long weekend, but criminals do. You may expect the same over this coming long weekend.

There are also some rumors of a DDOS campaign upon online gaming or finances. However, Cloudflare is doing a mech better job lately of detecting and deterring these.

How annoyingly US-centered! How dare he!?! I can only share what I know of.

Have a safe long weekend. Especially be prepared and safe if travelling. Take reasonable precautions to protect your families without overreacting.
Yeah, maybe I will have told you so. I hope this will not apply. I'll wish in one hand and see what fills up faster.

[mike miller]

FYI, I advise that you prepare for this USA holiday weekend by ensuring that you will have the food, gasoline, and any other necessary resource (cash, water, butt wipes, pharma, w/e) needed for the following week. At best, you've got necessities even if there isn't a major disruption. Don't go hoarding.

https://us-cert.cisa.gov/ncas/alerts/aa21-243a
CISA has no actionable threat intelligence to predict criminal action, but it is instead based upon the three major ransomware attacks on critical infrastructure over the past Mother's Day, Memorial Day, and Independence Day this year. IT staff is not working on the long weekend, but criminals do. You may expect the same over this coming long weekend.

There are also some rumors of a DDOS campaign upon online gaming or finances. However, Cloudflare is doing a mech better job lately of detecting and deterring these.

How annoyingly US-centered! How dare he!?! I can only share what I know of.

Have a safe long weekend. Especially be prepared and safe if travelling. Take reasonable precautions to protect your families without overreacting.
Yeah, maybe I will have told you so. I hope this will not apply. I'll wish in one hand and see what fills up faster.

Sounds like @Frederick_Law will be busy this weekend.

[zxys001]

It would be cool if the majority of US workers would still be interested in working instead of sucking the teat....

(additional perspective required).. da drumpf dude did that all his life and til this very day.

[Ömür Tokman]

I've often wondered how this worked. The US has a population of 331M. We have 73M under the age of 18 and 47 million over the age of 65. This leave ~211m people. The currently labor pool has ~160m people in it. We have 51M people between the age of 18 and 65 that aren't working? I'd actually say this number is even higher because we have a whole lot of people working that are over the age of 65. Not sure if under 18 is considered in the labor pool numbers though.

Nearly 25% of people of working age aren't working if we look at direct numbers and probably more if you consider late retiree's. Even if we pull out the stay at home parents ~13m we still have 38M people that aren't working. So one out of five people between the ages of 18 and 65 just don't work?

To make matters worse we have 160M people supporting 171M and those numbers are getting worse and worse as the boomers drop off one end and fewer and fewer people come in from the 0-18 age group.

It's not good.

according to this account, you need 1 worker, I can come.

[mike miller]

Back to the the whole "America-centered" thing.....I guess we could all set our location like this:

Anytown, Michigan, USA, Earth, Milky Way galaxy, Universe Alpha (presumably).

[Frederick_Law]

New research found center of our universe. It's in the White House where the president seat.

[zxys001]

New research found center of our universe. It's in the White House where the president seat.

..yeah,.. ~30% of the egodeludedcentric seem to "feel" so.

[MJuric]

according to this account, you need 1 worker, I can come.

I went to a Robotics thingy and they had the statistic that by 2024 2.2M jobs will be created in manufacturing from when I went, last June or so. They then followed that up with that they are predicting that only 1.1M people will be looking for jobs in manufacturing at that time.

This is why it's been near impossible to find decent people to work in manufacturing for probably the last 5-10 years and the problem started cropping up 10-20 years ago.

We have a pretty large swath of people that just don't feel the need to work and a much larger swath of people that are looking to do the bare minimum to stay employed. Employers are SOL at this point and are pretty much hostage the the employee until such time that the economy plunges into a massive depression and the government can no longer afford to support everyone.

I think I have to stop here before I swerve into politics and get kicked out of here

[zxys001]

yeah.. the US is still doing well.. but those darn Canadians are trying to make us look bad!?
https://data.oecd.org/pop/working-age-population.htm

[MJuric]

yeah.. the US is still doing well.. but those darn Canadians are trying to make us look bad!?
https://data.oecd.org/pop/working-age-population.htm

I'm less concerned about the working age population than I am the percentage of people working regardless of age. The higher the working age population number just means you have a larger chunk of the population between 15 and 64. If none of those people are actually working that's a bigger issue :-)

[MJuric]

You can't make people do something they don't want to do,

Making someone do something they don't want to is different than removing the natural consequences of what happens when you don't do something.

In other words, no you can't make someone work, but you also don't have to support them if they don't want to. Furthermore in this context "Support" would be anything implemented that eases the "pain" for either the employee or the employer that would be involved in not working or not hiring etc etc.... damn I promise. I'll stop now

[mike miller]

2 Thess. 3:10 "For even when we were with you, we gave you this rule: The one who is unwilling to work shall not eat."

Just a thought. And I'll leave it at that.......

[zxys001]

Making someone do something they don't want to is different than removing the natural consequences of what happens when you don't do something.

In other words, no you can't make someone work, but you also don't have to support them if they don't want to. Furthermore in this context "Support" would be anything implemented that eases the "pain" for either the employee or the employer that would be involved in not working or not hiring etc etc.... damn I promise. I'll stop now

Choices.....

[zxys001]

2 Thess. 3:10 "For even when we were with you, we gave you this rule: The one who is unwilling to work shall not eat."

Just a thought. And I'll leave it at that.......

yep,.. you can only do/help so much for the willing... but, we try anyhow.

[matt]

ok, please no negative racist connotations. Religion and politics make really bad discussion topics. There are bunches of facebook and twitter groups where you can fight about that. This is a professional forum where people with very different ideas about everything can come together on a common topic. Please don't make me moderate stuff, or add more stupid rules.

No matter what your point of view is you're not going to "fix" anyone here (or likely anywhere else either). Just allow people to believe what they believe in peace, regardless of how wrong you think they are.

...unless the topic is multibody sheet metal, in which case everyone else is just wrong. See? You don't feel any smarter, do you?

[MJuric]

No matter what your point of view is you're not going to "fix" anyone here (or likely anywhere else either). Just allow people to believe what they believe in peace, regardless of how wrong you think they are.

I wonder how many people believe this and why. Whether it's multi-body sheet metal or government welfare why should someone assume that the person they are discussing the issue with has both a closed mind and unwilling to hear or consider any new information or perspectives and also at the same time assume that the person you're discussing the issue with has no new information or perspectives to share that may alter your position?

Maybe I'm a bit of a unicorn in this sense. I come to discussion forums to learn things, not necessarily to teach things. If I'm unwilling to accept the possibility that someone else might know something or have a valid position that doesn't agree with mine....how am I supposed to learn anything?

I just find it odd how many people simply refuse to see any perspective but their own.

[bnemec]

I wonder how many people believe this and why. Whether it's multi-body sheet metal or government welfare why should someone assume that the person they are discussing the issue with has both a closed mind and unwilling to hear or consider any new information or perspectives and also at the same time assume that the person you're discussing the issue with has no new information or perspectives to share that may alter your position?

Maybe I'm a bit of a unicorn in this sense. I come to discussion forums to learn things, not necessarily to teach things. If I'm unwilling to accept the possibility that someone else might know something or have a valid position that doesn't agree with mine....how am I supposed to learn anything?

I just find it odd how many people simply refuse to see any perspective but their own.

This might be a case where taking one sentence out of the context in which it was used will likely change the intended meaning. I took that comment in the context of avoiding fruitless arguments, where the other side has already demonstrated their right to take a stand. So sometimes I agree with that statement, the trick is identifying when to apply it.

On the contrary I've found that those who helped with my own wrong opinions had mastered the art of asking questions that could not be mistaken as challenges and in the end reveled to me my own bad assumptions or completely missing bits of data that lead to the faulted opinion. Once the inputs where corrected I had to change my opinion, or step over to the side of belligerence just to avoid accepting that I was wrong before. Some where through the years I shifted from "being right" to preferring enlightenment even at the cost of admitting I was wrong.

[matt]

I just find it odd how many people simply refuse to see any perspective but their own.

Yeah, a lot of people from many different persuasions wonder that about the rest of the world. Some people can't let differences be differences. I'm not saying we have any of those people here, I just want to avoid finding out. There's nothing to gain by having a big throwdown about the nightly news here.

I am a member at a forum where they literally banned discussions of manufacturing and economics because even fact based stuff like that becomes politicized. Insane, right? I'm not trying to prevent anyone from learning, I'm just trying to avoid the inevitable conflict that poisons a place like this where we might disagree, but behave for the most part.

So I'd appreciate it if y'all could take that somewhere else, and not put me in the middle of it. I wanna talk about CAD and boring geek stuff. I watch this happen in other places, and would like to avoid it here.

[mike miller]

Yeah, a lot of people from many different persuasions wonder that about the rest of the world. Some people can't let differences be differences. I'm not saying we have any of those people here, I just want to avoid finding out. There's nothing to gain by having a big throwdown about the nightly news here.

I am a member at a forum where they literally banned discussions of manufacturing and economics because even fact based stuff like that becomes politicized. Insane, right? I'm not trying to prevent anyone from learning, I'm just trying to avoid the inevitable conflict that poisons a place like this where we might disagree, but behave for the most part.

So I'd appreciate it if y'all could take that somewhere else, and not put me in the middle of it. I wanna talk about CAD and boring geek stuff. I watch this happen in other places, and would like to avoid it here.

Multi-body sheet metal modeling is the ONLY way to go!

[zxys001]

Ok,.. we all need to step back and tap into our Happy Unicorn!

[mattpeneguy]

I just find it odd how many people simply refuse to see any perspective but their own.

I've found that a persuasive discussion tactic is to interrupt the other person and yell "THINK LIKE ME!!!" over anything they say...

[SPerman]

I just find it odd how many people simply refuse to see any perspective but their own.

And no matter how many times I tell them they are wrong, they just don't see the error in their ways.

[zxys001]

You'll (not including me ) are so right,... yet, so wrong.

[Jaylin Hochstetler]

Yeah, a lot of people from many different persuasions wonder that about the rest of the world. Some people can't let differences be differences. I'm not saying we have any of those people here, I just want to avoid finding out. There's nothing to gain by having a big throwdown about the nightly news here.

I am a member at a forum where they literally banned discussions of manufacturing and economics because even fact based stuff like that becomes politicized. Insane, right? I'm not trying to prevent anyone from learning, I'm just trying to avoid the inevitable conflict that poisons a place like this where we might disagree, but behave for the most part.

So I'd appreciate it if y'all could take that somewhere else, and not put me in the middle of it. I wanna talk about CAD and boring geek stuff. I watch this happen in other places, and would like to avoid it here.

I totally agree, this is a CAD Forum not a Politics Forum.

[zxys001]

... there is hope for you smokers..
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/scie ... acco-plant

[mattpeneguy]

And no matter how many times I tell them they are wrong, they just don't see the error in their ways.

Have you tried raising your voice?...that can be helpful...it doesn't hurt to also use derogatory expletives...

[zxys001]

Have you tried raising your voice?...that can be helpful...it doesn't hurt to also use derogatory expletives...

...using a respectful and proper oratory enunciation delivery.

[jcapriotti]

I totally agree, this is a CAD Forum not a Politics Forum.

What about CAD Politics?

[Glenn Schroeder]

What about CAD Politics?

I suspect you already know the answer to that one.

[Jaylin Hochstetler]

What about CAD Politics?

Hey, as long as it involves CAD and it's not American-Centered!